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Thread: New Big 12 TV Deal

  1. #351
    fucktard jdbolick headed for a crowd source bannination jdbolick headed for a crowd source bannination jdbolick headed for a crowd source bannination jdbolick headed for a crowd source bannination jdbolick headed for a crowd source bannination
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    MoJames knows me from another place and asked me to come tell you what fools you're making yourselves out to be. No one from the ACC is leaving to join the Big XII. I'm a Carolina fan and still have love for Mack Brown, so I'm glad that you guys didn't end up shafted by the conference disappearing entirely, but you're embarrassing yourselves with this "pie in the sky" absurdity that the Big XII has somehow gone from flat-lining to now being so desirable that teams from other BCS conferences will jump ship. Yes, you got West Virginia, but that's only because the Big East was completely dissolving as a football conference and every other conference WVU would rather be in turned them down first. The Big XII accepted WVU when other conferences turned them down because you guys were desperate and you don't care about academics.

    That's really a big part you're missing in all this obsession with TV money. Sure, TV contracts matter a lot and have been the driving force behind conference realignment, but university presidents still place enormous value on academic prestige. Notre Dame in particular is incredibly snotty about their academics and would never even consider joining the Big XII for that reason alone. The Big Ten & ACC have that in abundance, and its member institutions greatly appreciate being in conferences that have such prestige. Meanwhile the Big XII is probably the worst academically of the BCS conferences now, and that does matter to your endowments and alumni donors.

    Thirdly, you're hilariously overestimating the value of Tier 3 television rights in other parts of the country simply because they're so valuable in Texas. You guys are crazy about your college sports, in part because there is absolutely nothing better to do out there, so those rights carry a lot more value than in other parts of the country where people actually go outside or have activities that don't involve watching men's volleyball on the school network. Clemson & Florida State wouldn't get much for their Tier 3 package, which is why Raycom has always been able to license that so cheaply. The notion that anyone in other parts of the country can immediately add $15+ million to their bottom line simply by joining the Big XII is absurd. ACC schools have no interest in the Big XII at all. Notre Dame has absolutely no interest in the Big XII at all. Let it go.

    Basically, you guys need to stop making asses of yourselves by speculating endlessly about which schools you might be able to get into this botched abortion of a conference. As noted, I am legitimately glad that you guys didn't get completely screwed by the feckless cowards at TAMU & Missouri, but just be happy that your conference still exists and stop this nonsense that you've somehow gone from nearly dissolving to suddenly being irresistibly attractive to other universities. That level of delusion is pretty sad, even considering that there's really not a lot to occupy your time this time of year unless you're still in the NCAA tournament or following spring training in Florida or Arizona.

  2. #352
    asshat randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles's Avatar
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    jdb, conference money may not matter that much to North Carolina, but it does a lot more to FSU, Miami, and Clemson. This is for two reasons: they are not backed up by endowments to nearly the degree you are, and they actually face direct competition with the SEC in their home states, meaning things like facilities and coaching salaries are apples to apples worse than their rivals, which hurts recruiting. FSU's credit downgrade based on reliance on boosters to meet budget is not something that should be ignored either. You are absolutely right that academic association plays a role when choosing athletic conferences (though aside from the Big Ten's CIC, it's a purely superficial association). The question becomes, how much is that association worth? $5 million per year? $10 million? It looks like they would make that much more if they jumped over to the Big 12 before tier 3 (if the Big 12 contract's escalator clauses are to be believed).

    And if you want to put tangential things like academics in an athletic conference into play, I'll play the ACC commissioner card. I've spent time on ACC boards lately, and the general feel is that you guys took ESPN's offer without asking Fox for a final counteroffer because your commissioner wanted ESPN, possibly because the commissioner's son works for Raycom, the company ESPN promised radio rights to. Your conference has schools' fanbases who firmly believe their commissioner does not have their best interests at heart. How much is getting out of that situation worth?

    We are not all proclaiming that ACC schools are as good as over here. We are hearing rumors of discussions, seeing objective evidence as to why such a move would make sense, and postulating what could come next. As you said, this is the offseason. If you can't see that several schools in your conference have a very real reason to think about leaving, you are in denial and the situation will only get worse for you.

    link citing FSU's credit downgrade rationale: http://www.moodys.com/research/MOODY...-TO--PR_236746
    Last edited by randomscribbles; 03-22-2012 at 01:23 PM.

  3. #353
    fucktard jdbolick headed for a crowd source bannination jdbolick headed for a crowd source bannination jdbolick headed for a crowd source bannination jdbolick headed for a crowd source bannination jdbolick headed for a crowd source bannination
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    Those rumors are other internet websites engaging in idle speculation, such that it becomes circular justification where one site reports rumors from another site whose source happens to be rumors from another site. There is no actual reality to FSU, Clemson, Miami, or Georgia Tech having any interest in joining the Big XII, which is why only Big XII fans create and foster such "rumors." It's wishful thinking, nothing more.

    The reality is that the rest of the country still views the Big XII as an unstable entity. You survived a collapse before and then survived another, but that doesn't exactly inspire confidence that another collapse isn't lurking around the corner. It does seem unlikely given the steps taken to prevent exactly such a recurrence, but no other major conference besides the Big East is viewed so skeptically. The ACC is stable, successful, and prestigious. There are grumblings about the commissioner, some of them justified, but that kind of thing always takes place.

    Additionally, it's worth noting the basic mathematical fact that total value divided among ten schools produces a higher average than among eleven or twelve. Unless the networks agree to increase the total value proportionately (unlikely), then the more schools you add, the less each member gets.

  4. #354
    asshat Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jdbolick View Post
    You guys are crazy about your college sports, in part because there is absolutely nothing better to do out there, so those rights carry a lot more value than in other parts of the country where people actually go outside or have activities that don't involve watching men's volleyball on the school network.
    Obvious troll is obvious.


  5. #355
    asshat The University is probably pretty witty. or good at photoshop. or porn. The University is probably pretty witty. or good at photoshop. or porn. The University is probably pretty witty. or good at photoshop. or porn. The University is probably pretty witty. or good at photoshop. or porn. The University is probably pretty witty. or good at photoshop. or porn. The University is probably pretty witty. or good at photoshop. or porn. The University is probably pretty witty. or good at photoshop. or porn. The University is probably pretty witty. or good at photoshop. or porn. The University is probably pretty witty. or good at photoshop. or porn. The University is probably pretty witty. or good at photoshop. or porn. The University is probably pretty witty. or good at photoshop. or porn. The University's Avatar
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    With one post, jdbolick dethroned Kony and stabilized the NCAA cartel for another century. Well played, sir. Well played.

  6. #356
    asshat randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jdbolick View Post
    Those rumors are other internet websites engaging in idle speculation, such that it becomes circular justification where one site reports rumors from another site whose source happens to be rumors from another site. There is no actual reality to FSU, Clemson, Miami, or Georgia Tech having any interest in joining the Big XII, which is why only Big XII fans create and foster such "rumors." It's wishful thinking, nothing more.

    The reality is that the rest of the country still views the Big XII as an unstable entity. You survived a collapse before and then survived another, but that doesn't exactly inspire confidence that another collapse isn't lurking around the corner. It does seem unlikely given the steps taken to prevent exactly such a recurrence, but no other major conference besides the Big East is viewed so skeptically. The ACC is stable, successful, and prestigious. There are grumblings about the commissioner, some of them justified, but that kind of thing always takes place.

    Additionally, it's worth noting the basic mathematical fact that total value divided among ten schools produces a higher average than among eleven or twelve. Unless the networks agree to increase the total value proportionately (unlikely), then the more schools you add, the less each member gets.
    OK, a few things. First, while this did indeed start with several unsubstantiated rumors, not all are from Big 12 sources. Best that I can tell, slightly different but substantially similar 'insider reports' popped up around the same time on sites for WVU, BYU, and UConn. Two of those schools are not in the Big 12- their common denominator is the fact that their fanbases have been closely watching realignment for a while now, not allegiance to one conference. It could all be a well planned hoax, but if so it was an extremely well executed one.

    Public perception is a hell of a thing, but thanks to our grant of rights, we are now far more stable than the ACC is. We have a zero percent chance of losing another school for six years, and that number is likely to be extended to 2025, the end of our media contracts. I would argue that because the Big East is so picked dry, the ACC is now the most vulnerable conference to be poached at this point, as they have the worst financials, easiest buyout, and still have quality schools.

    Third, your financial argument makes no sense. If that were the case, why did you add Pitt and Cuse? You added more teams, which will surely lead to a smaller per team payout, right? Why is realignment happening at all for that matter? Why are there rumored boosts in per team payouts for the Big 12 in our new contract in the case of expansion? If your argument were the case, schools would be running to become indy, as they only have to divide the payout by one, thus maximizing their profits. This argument sounds, to me personally, more like self rationalization as to why you are safe than an actual argument. Objective facts simply do not agree with the conclusion.

  7. #357
    dead from aggy misery od Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL's Avatar
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    I'll not get into any discussion of what is happening or what is going to happen, because none of us knows. But your argument is based on faulty premises, so it's impossible to give credence to your ultimate conclusion that "it's wishful thinking, nothing more." Specifically:

    Quote Originally Posted by jdbolick View Post
    Sure, TV contracts matter a lot and have been the driving force behind conference realignment . . . .
    Yes, they have. And your post could have ended right there, and you'd be 100% correct. Every bit of conference realignment has been driven by television contracts. Every. Last. Bit.

    But after you acknowledge that, you try to minimize it--"yeah, I know money has been the sole driver of realignment, but, but, but there are other things that are important, too."

    Bull$#@!. There are other things that are going to get lip service, but that's all. The university presidents have shown what they care about in conference realignment, and that's money.

    Quote Originally Posted by jdbolick View Post
    [U]niversity presidents still place enormous value on academic prestige. Notre Dame in particular is incredibly snotty about their academics and would never even consider joining the Big XII for that reason alone. The Big Ten & ACC have that in abundance, and its member institutions greatly appreciate being in conferences that have such prestige. Meanwhile the Big XII is probably the worst academically of the BCS conferences now, and that does matter to your endowments and alumni donors.
    Wait, what?

    Let's take this in reverse order:

    1) What alumni donor has said, "I'm not donating as much now that you're in a $#@!ty conference"? How many have said "now that you're in a better academic conference, I'm going to donate more"? I think the answer to both questions is precisely zero.

    2) This is one of those "lip service" things to which I referred previously. University presidents give a lot of lip service to academics in an athletic conference, but at the end of the day they recognize that we're talking about an athletic conference. That was revealed pretty glaringly when the B1G--which gives more lip service to academics than any other conference--accepted Nebraska as a member. Really. They took $#@!ing Nebraska. They might as well have taken a community college.

    3) The reality is that universities need athletic money to fund academics, or at least not be a drain on their academic budgets. Texas isn't alone in cutting budgets to higher education. That's happening all across the country. Public universities need to make up for that shortfall somehow. Texas is doing so in part with money that the athletic department is kicking back to the academic side of the university. I can guarantee you that university presidents would like to copy that model.

    More money for academics derived from a profitable athletic department is vastly more valuable to a university president that being able to say, "yea! we get to be in the same conference as UVA."

    4) To the extent you mean to imply that Notre Dame would join the B1G over the Big XII, you're absolutely wrong. Notre Dame's first preference (and second and third and fourth preferences) is to remain independent. But their absolute last preference--for reasons I've discussed ad nauseum on this board--would be to join the B1G. Notre Dame hates that conference, and would never willingly join it.

    Quote Originally Posted by jdbolick View Post
    The reality is that the rest of the country still views the Big XII as an unstable entity.
    University presidents aren't going to make decisions with enormous financial implications because you or "the rest of the country" has an outdated view of the Big XII.

    Money begets stability in the modern athletic conference universe. With this purported offer, the Big XII has money. Hence it is stable. The ACC does not have money. Hence it is unstable.

    Quote Originally Posted by jdbolick View Post
    Additionally, it's worth noting the basic mathematical fact that total value divided among ten schools produces a higher average than among eleven or twelve. Unless the networks agree to increase the total value proportionately (unlikely), then the more schools you add, the less each member gets.
    You're right that they're not increasing the total value proportionately. They've reportedly agreed to increase the value disproportionately to give even more money to each school for every expansion school. So the Big XII has a strong financial incentive to expand.

  8. #358
    Rocko Tag jester grows his own roses jester grows his own roses jester grows his own roses jester grows his own roses jester grows his own roses jester grows his own roses jester grows his own roses jester grows his own roses jester grows his own roses jester grows his own roses jester grows his own roses jester's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jdbolick View Post
    Additionally, it's worth noting the basic mathematical fact that total value divided among ten schools produces a higher average than among eleven or twelve. Unless the networks agree to increase the total value proportionately (unlikely), then the more schools you add, the less each member gets.
    No waiiiii! srsly? 100/12 < 100/10 ???

    You can't be this retarded can you? Did you read any portion of this thread regarding the TV rights if more schools are added or did you just come over here and start typing? I'd recap but $#@! off. Go read it yourself dip$#@!.

    Is this stupid speculation? Yup. Off season and what not.

  9. #359
    asshat The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link's Avatar
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    Additionally, it's worth noting the basic mathematical fact that total value divided among ten schools produces a higher average than among eleven or twelve. Unless the networks agree to increase the total value proportionately (unlikely), then the more schools you add, the less each member gets.
    Our contract value expands greater than proportionally. That, plus the total dollar value, is what's driving the speculation.

  10. #360
    Quote Originally Posted by MoJames View Post
    I suppose I shouldn't be surprised that you enjoy rape.

    Excellent Clayton Williams reference.

  11. #361
    dipshit Kiljare is a gaywad assfaget Kiljare is a gaywad assfaget
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    WTF is all this love for Clemson? They bring someone for FSU to play or something should they decide to leave a basketball conference? They went to a BCS bowl and got treated like Hawaii, have won 1 NC ever and have like zero prestige, tv sets, or incentive to watch a game other than UT if they are playing. Srsly $#@! clemson, substitute them with a real school that makes actual money. Louisville is a far better choice and I can't stand them either.

  12. #362
    Quote Originally Posted by Kiljare View Post
    WTF is all this love for Clemson? They bring someone for FSU to play or something should they decide to leave a basketball conference? They went to a BCS bowl and got treated like Hawaii, have won 1 NC ever and have like zero prestige, tv sets, or incentive to watch a game other than UT if they are playing. Srsly $#@! clemson, substitute them with a real school that makes actual money. Louisville is a far better choice and I can't stand them either.
    So you're an SC fan huh? That's cool. Welp, see ya later.

  13. #363
    asshat Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet is a rep whore. Prophet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiljare View Post
    WTF is all this love for Clemson? They bring someone for FSU to play or something should they decide to leave a basketball conference? They went to a BCS bowl and got treated like Hawaii, have won 1 NC ever and have like zero prestige, tv sets, or incentive to watch a game other than UT if they are playing. Srsly $#@! clemson, substitute them with a real school that makes actual money. Louisville is a far better choice and I can't stand them either.
    Why pass up the best football team in the state of South Carolina, the most valuable ACC team likely to leave (behind Florida State) and a great regional partner for the Florida schools?

  14. #364
    asshat jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiljare View Post
    WTF is all this love for Clemson? They bring someone for FSU to play or something should they decide to leave a basketball conference? They went to a BCS bowl and got treated like Hawaii, have won 1 NC ever and have like zero prestige, tv sets, or incentive to watch a game other than UT if they are playing. Srsly $#@! clemson, substitute them with a real school that makes actual money. Louisville is a far better choice and I can't stand them either.
    W-sip (are we allowed to use that term on the Shag?) fan is obvious.

  15. #365
    asshat randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtk1519 View Post
    W-sip (are we allowed to use that term on the Shag?) fan is obvious.
    Some memes need to travel as the fanbase does. $#@! the w-sips (tee hee!)

  16. #366
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    The two big12 programs that bred instability from within are now gone, Missouri and Nebraska, that alone makes the conference more stable, add the grant of media rights and the money and this conference is quite stable. As for tier 3, schools like FSU and Clemson with large baseball followings sure as $#@! would enjoy owning their tier 3 rights exclusively. With stability, a unique model and no possible avenue to the SEC, the big 12 isn't that hard to see as a good fit for a few southern ACC teams.

  17. #367
    God damn $#@!ing tobacco-aggy bastards. I swear. Nothing is better than Carolina, and the tobacco conference. Of course you're going to think it's great. Duh, you are the acc. Other schools within said group... not so much.

    And...


    $#@!ing Catalina Offseason as well. $#@!.

  18. #368
    dipshit Kiljare is a gaywad assfaget Kiljare is a gaywad assfaget
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    Sorry, I don't know what a W-sip fan is or I could possibly respond. I'm a Texas fan, graduated from Burnet, and now living in Chicago. I have no love for SC, but no particular hate either. To me Clemson is just another version of aggy and I see no value they bring that other schools couldn't bring in a far superior way. From all the financial numbers I've seen Louisville is far superior and then we don't have a school from a backward ass state like SC, but to each their own. Yeah I see now that a school from Kentucky doesn't exactly lend credence to that....

  19. #369
    dead from aggy misery od Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL might be a clever chap. or know the right people. know what i mean, nudge nudge? Ghost of LL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiljare View Post
    Sorry, I don't know what a W-sip fan is or I could possibly respond. I'm a Texas fan, graduated from Burnet, and now living in Chicago. I have no love for SC, but no particular hate either. To me Clemson is just another version of aggy and I see no value they bring that other schools couldn't bring in a far superior way. From all the financial numbers I've seen Louisville is far superior and then we don't have a school from a backward ass state like SC, but to each their own. Yeah I see now that a school from Kentucky doesn't exactly lend credence to that....
    I don't have any particular feeling for Clemson one way or the other, but I don't believe for a second that Louisville has superior financial numbers. Please post whatever has led you to that conclusion.

  20. #370
    dipshit Kiljare is a gaywad assfaget Kiljare is a gaywad assfaget
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost of LL View Post
    I don't have any particular feeling for Clemson one way or the other, but I don't believe for a second that Louisville has superior financial numbers. Please post whatever has led you to that conclusion.
    http://businessofcollegesports.com/2...s-departments/

    There are other links on that site as far as revenue numbers etc., but from everything I've read Louisville's B-ball department is far and away the most profitable in the country for that sport and was top 25 overall.

  21. #371
    Quote Originally Posted by jester View Post
    No waiiiii! srsly? 100/12 < 100/10 ???

    You can't be this retarded can you? Did you read any portion of this thread regarding the TV rights if more schools are added or did you just come over here and start typing? I'd recap but $#@! off. Go read it yourself dip$#@!.

    Is this stupid speculation? Yup. Off season and what not.
    apparently the ACC was.

  22. #372
    asshat randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. randomscribbles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiljare View Post
    http://businessofcollegesports.com/2...s-departments/

    There are other links on that site as far as revenue numbers etc., but from everything I've read Louisville's B-ball department is far and away the most profitable in the country for that sport and was top 25 overall.
    I completely agree that Louisville is very undervalued as an addition by the general public, and in all reality they are very likely to be added in the not too distant future, regardless of other expansion. Their athletic budget is impressive (I tend to see budget size as a more important number than profits when looking at expansion appeal). And their basketball program would be a jewel in the conference's crown right next to Kansas. Given big boy conference money, they would be in a place to really go places in all sports. But Clemson is of the same general status, and is likely to bring two bigger schools with them. That's the appeal.

    Comparative budgets: http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/J...h/Budgets.aspx

  23. #373
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost of LL View Post
    I don't have any particular feeling for Clemson one way or the other, but I don't believe for a second that Louisville has superior financial numbers. Please post whatever has led you to that conclusion.
    Believe it.

    Revenue...
    Louisville - $87.7 million (more than FSU, corn aggy, USC, aggy, etc.)
    Clemson - $61.2 million
    http://businessofcollegesports.com/2...ment-revenues/

    Budget...
    Louisville - $83.8 million (more than Georgia, Arkie, Notre Dame and the corn & aggy)
    Clemson - $60.9 million
    http://businessofcollegesports.com/2...ment-spenders/

    Profit...
    Louisville - $3.9 million (more than Auburn, aggy, Wisky, etc.)
    Clemson - $216,318
    http://businessofcollegesports.com/2...s-departments/

    Louisville makes a ton of money off it's men's basketball program. Last season UL men's basketball posted a PROFIT of $27.6 million. To put that into context, that's more than Okie Lite and Tech made and just shy of what aggy made... on FOOTBALL. That's more money than South Carolina football, Ole Miss football, Ohio State football, Wisconsin and Iowa football. UL basketball brought in more money than any Pac 12 basketball or football program.

    Now imagine how much money Louisville would be rolling in if they improve their football program. That's why I've been touting UL as an expansion candidate for a long time. Decent athletic school that brings in money and is not afraid to spend it. Good TV market and at the very least takes Big XII basketball up a few notches.

  24. #374
    how does louisville make all that money off their basketball program? iirc, one chart showed their basketball profitability is in the top 25 when compared to football profits. that's astounding. is it all papa johns and taco bell?

  25. #375
    asshat jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elfenix View Post
    how does louisville make all that money off their basketball program? iirc, one chart showed their basketball profitability is in the top 25 when compared to football profits. that's astounding. is it all papa johns and taco bell?
    Brand new arenas with almost 23,000 seats, 75 luxury suites, 2,000 club seats and a stupid corporate name bring in a lot of wallet.

  26. #376
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    I don't care how much money Louisville makes. I'd take Clemson and a host of other teams before them.

  27. #377
    asshat jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519 grows his own roses jtk1519's Avatar
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    Louisville has finished ahead of Clemson in the Director's Cup standings every year since '06. They are in just about every way superior to Clemson, but Clemson is getting the buzz now because there is a perception that they are tethered to Florida State and FSU + Clemson > Louisville.

  28. #378
    asshat maninblack Shaggy Gold Club maninblack Shaggy Gold Club maninblack Shaggy Gold Club maninblack Shaggy Gold Club maninblack Shaggy Gold Club maninblack Shaggy Gold Club maninblack Shaggy Gold Club maninblack Shaggy Gold Club maninblack Shaggy Gold Club maninblack Shaggy Gold Club maninblack Shaggy Gold Club maninblack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtk1519 View Post
    Louisville has finished ahead of Clemson in the Director's Cup standings every year since '06.

  29. #379
    dipshit Kiljare is a gaywad assfaget Kiljare is a gaywad assfaget
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtk1519 View Post
    Louisville has finished ahead of Clemson in the Director's Cup standings every year since '06. They are in just about every way superior to Clemson, but Clemson is getting the buzz now because there is a perception that they are tethered to Florida State and FSU + Clemson > Louisville.
    Thank you...this is all I wanted to know. I still think they are the Southeast version of aggy and would rather have just about anyone else besides them, but if we had to bite the bullet to get FSU, then I guess I could stomach it.

  30. #380
    Quote Originally Posted by jtk1519 View Post
    Believe it.

    Revenue...
    Louisville - $87.7 million (more than FSU, corn aggy, USC, aggy, etc.)
    Clemson - $61.2 million
    http://businessofcollegesports.com/2...ment-revenues/

    Budget...
    Louisville - $83.8 million (more than Georgia, Arkie, Notre Dame and the corn & aggy)
    Clemson - $60.9 million
    http://businessofcollegesports.com/2...ment-spenders/

    Profit...
    Louisville - $3.9 million (more than Auburn, aggy, Wisky, etc.)
    Clemson - $216,318
    http://businessofcollegesports.com/2...s-departments/

    Louisville makes a ton of money off it's men's basketball program. Last season UL men's basketball posted a PROFIT of $27.6 million. To put that into context, that's more than Okie Lite and Tech made and just shy of what aggy made... on FOOTBALL. That's more money than South Carolina football, Ole Miss football, Ohio State football, Wisconsin and Iowa football. UL basketball brought in more money than any Pac 12 basketball or football program.

    Now imagine how much money Louisville would be rolling in if they improve their football program. That's why I've been touting UL as an expansion candidate for a long time. Decent athletic school that brings in money and is not afraid to spend it. Good TV market and at the very least takes Big XII basketball up a few notches.
    I was floored when I saw their bb revenue a while back, but none of that says to me that they have a great TV following, especially where it matters in football. I think they're underrated by a lot of people as an expansion candidate, but I don't think profitability or athletic budget is correlated to what they could or could not bring to the conference's TV contracts. I think Clemson brings more, but that's just my gut. I admittedly bring no figures to the table to support that.

  31. #381
    cornholio jTower can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. jTower can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. jTower can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. jTower can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. jTower can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. jTower can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. jTower can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. jTower can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. jTower can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. jTower can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. jTower can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. jTower's Avatar
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by randomscribbles View Post
    And just look at those pods. At least one marquee power and one strong secondary power in each of them. National. Clean. Amazing. This is the dream.

    This

  32. #382
    Quote Originally Posted by jdbolick View Post
    MoJames knows me from another place and asked me to come tell you what fools you're making yourselves out to be. No one from the ACC is leaving to join the Big XII. I'm a Carolina fan and still have love for Mack Brown, so I'm glad that you guys didn't end up shafted by the conference disappearing entirely, but you're embarrassing yourselves with this "pie in the sky" absurdity that the Big XII has somehow gone from flat-lining to now being so desirable that teams from other BCS conferences will jump ship. Yes, you got West Virginia, but that's only because the Big East was completely dissolving as a football conference and every other conference WVU would rather be in turned them down first. The Big XII accepted WVU when other conferences turned them down because you guys were desperate and you don't care about academics.

    That's really a big part you're missing in all this obsession with TV money. Sure, TV contracts matter a lot and have been the driving force behind conference realignment, but university presidents still place enormous value on academic prestige. Notre Dame in particular is incredibly snotty about their academics and would never even consider joining the Big XII for that reason alone. The Big Ten & ACC have that in abundance, and its member institutions greatly appreciate being in conferences that have such prestige. Meanwhile the Big XII is probably the worst academically of the BCS conferences now, and that does matter to your endowments and alumni donors.

    Thirdly, you're hilariously overestimating the value of Tier 3 television rights in other parts of the country simply because they're so valuable in Texas. You guys are crazy about your college sports, in part because there is absolutely nothing better to do out there, so those rights carry a lot more value than in other parts of the country where people actually go outside or have activities that don't involve watching men's volleyball on the school network. Clemson & Florida State wouldn't get much for their Tier 3 package, which is why Raycom has always been able to license that so cheaply. The notion that anyone in other parts of the country can immediately add $15+ million to their bottom line simply by joining the Big XII is absurd. ACC schools have no interest in the Big XII at all. Notre Dame has absolutely no interest in the Big XII at all. Let it go.

    Basically, you guys need to stop making asses of yourselves by speculating endlessly about which schools you might be able to get into this botched abortion of a conference. As noted, I am legitimately glad that you guys didn't get completely screwed by the feckless cowards at TAMU & Missouri, but just be happy that your conference still exists and stop this nonsense that you've somehow gone from nearly dissolving to suddenly being irresistibly attractive to other universities. That level of delusion is pretty sad, even considering that there's really not a lot to occupy your time this time of year unless you're still in the NCAA tournament or following spring training in Florida or Arizona.

    well thank god you and MoJames were here to set us straight.

  33. #383
    asshat juz Shaggy Gold Club juz Shaggy Gold Club juz Shaggy Gold Club juz Shaggy Gold Club juz Shaggy Gold Club juz Shaggy Gold Club juz Shaggy Gold Club juz Shaggy Gold Club juz Shaggy Gold Club juz Shaggy Gold Club juz Shaggy Gold Club juz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jdbolick View Post

    You guys are crazy about your college sports, in part because there is absolutely nothing better to do out there, .


    and you think we're making asses of ourselves ?

  34. #384
    asshat MaxATX can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. MaxATX can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. MaxATX can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. MaxATX can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. MaxATX can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. MaxATX can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. MaxATX can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. MaxATX can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. MaxATX can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. MaxATX can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night. MaxATX can play the whole course with a 4 iron. At night.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jdbolick View Post
    you're embarrassing yourselves with this "pie in the sky" absurdity that the Big XII has somehow gone from flat-lining to now being so desirable that teams from other BCS conferences will jump ship.

  35. #385
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    Quote Originally Posted by jdbolick View Post
    MoJames knows me from another place and asked me to come tell you what fools you're making yourselves out to be. No one from the ACC is leaving to join the Big XII. I'm a Carolina fan and still have love for Mack Brown, so I'm glad that you guys didn't end up shafted by the conference disappearing entirely, but you're embarrassing yourselves with this "pie in the sky" absurdity that the Big XII has somehow gone from flat-lining to now being so desirable that teams from other BCS conferences will jump ship. Yes, you got West Virginia, but that's only because the Big East was completely dissolving as a football conference and every other conference WVU would rather be in turned them down first. The Big XII accepted WVU when other conferences turned them down because you guys were desperate and you don't care about academics.

    That's really a big part you're missing in all this obsession with TV money. Sure, TV contracts matter a lot and have been the driving force behind conference realignment, but university presidents still place enormous value on academic prestige. Notre Dame in particular is incredibly snotty about their academics and would never even consider joining the Big XII for that reason alone. The Big Ten & ACC have that in abundance, and its member institutions greatly appreciate being in conferences that have such prestige. Meanwhile the Big XII is probably the worst academically of the BCS conferences now, and that does matter to your endowments and alumni donors.

    Thirdly, you're hilariously overestimating the value of Tier 3 television rights in other parts of the country simply because they're so valuable in Texas. You guys are crazy about your college sports, in part because there is absolutely nothing better to do out there, so those rights carry a lot more value than in other parts of the country where people actually go outside or have activities that don't involve watching men's volleyball on the school network. Clemson & Florida State wouldn't get much for their Tier 3 package, which is why Raycom has always been able to license that so cheaply. The notion that anyone in other parts of the country can immediately add $15+ million to their bottom line simply by joining the Big XII is absurd. ACC schools have no interest in the Big XII at all. Notre Dame has absolutely no interest in the Big XII at all. Let it go.

    Basically, you guys need to stop making asses of yourselves by speculating endlessly about which schools you might be able to get into this botched abortion of a conference. As noted, I am legitimately glad that you guys didn't get completely screwed by the feckless cowards at TAMU & Missouri, but just be happy that your conference still exists and stop this nonsense that you've somehow gone from nearly dissolving to suddenly being irresistibly attractive to other universities. That level of delusion is pretty sad, even considering that there's really not a lot to occupy your time this time of year unless you're still in the NCAA tournament or following spring training in Florida or Arizona.
    What stock should I buy?

  36. #386
    asshat The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link slams and goes hard. The Missing Link's Avatar
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    Reworked annual school allotment - includes new deals, escalation, and t3 contracts:

    1) B12: $13.6MM + t3
    2) SEC: $12.9MM + t3
    3) B10: $18.8MM
    4) PAC: $18.1MM
    5) ACC: $16.1MM

    - Note that the amount of media rights retained in each conference has varying degrees, as does the potential money each school can make off of them. "Varying degrees" can be a whole lot of money (Texas is making about the same off of retained rights as pooled rights).
    - If you are wondering why my numbers are different than Kristi Dosh's, it mostly has to do with escalation - getting paid later is not as good as getting paid now.
    Last edited by The Missing Link; 05-14-2012 at 02:25 PM.

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