Last edited by OnBoard; 01-14-2012 at 03:52 PM.
Yes, the entire purpose of the Constitution was to create a strong central government that would smack down the states when needed. Under the Articles of the Confederacy, the states were all levying usurious taxes on all products from other states and severely inhibiting trade. The entire purpose of convening to modify the Articles, which resulted in scrapping them altogether and writing the Constitution, was to create a stronger central government that would prevent that $#@! from happening. What, was that not in your book?
The power of secession is not delegated to the U.S. or prohibited to the States, therefore it's reserved to the States or the people.The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
Unless you can find some mention of secession in the Constitution.
Yes, Texas v. White (I talked about that previously in this thread and what a joke of an opinion it was from Justice Chase). The states have no right to secede because the PREAMBLE to the Constitution (you know the introduction to the Constitution) used the phrase "more perfect union?" That's why States can't secede? What horse$#@!.
Here is a blog post on the topic I kinda like: http://www.pickyourbattles.net/2011/...k-in-time.html
Why don't you simply go by the words of the guy who wrote the Constitution, which I posted already? I'd say he probably knew better than anyone how secession fares constitutionally.
Since the power to declare war war is that of the federal legislature and the power to lead the troops is in the legislature and the power to make a finding of treason is within the power of the federal judiciary and the power to define the punishment for treason is with the federal legilsture, I think the US Constitution does more than an adequate job of conferring those powers on the federal government, and in fact Section 10 of Article One prohibits states from one prohibits states from entering into any Treaty, Alliance or Confederation.
I'd argue that the privileges and immunities clause (Section 2, Article IV) also prohibits states from attempting to prohibit their citizenry from the privilges and rights of US citizenship by secession.
So I don't think the right to secede has been retained by the states.
If it was so important that the voluntary UNION of the several colonies/states meant being LOCKED IN FOREVER - then it would have been covered. It wasn't because that idea is $#@!ing retarded. To think that a State would have agreed to that given the history is ludicrous. Sure, the Articles of Confederation were weak, but there is no way Americans went into this great compact thinking they were locked in after that point. That is why it is NOT mentioned in the Constitution, and why the Tenth makes it clear they can leave if they feel the federal government is trampling their rights.
You don't have to agree with their decision to leave, and we can all agree it's going to be a fight regardless of the law (see Civil War), but it's silly to think the States agreed to be locked into a union.
If secession was out of the question, and the decision was permanent, it would have been covered. It wasn't. End of story.
Last edited by VAPA; 01-14-2012 at 05:06 PM. Reason: and I realize TJ didn't have anything to do with the Constitution, but you get my point
I just want to mention again that I don't like the South. Except their women. Mmmm....yeah, I'd like to carpetbag the $#@! out of that...
That right there is why secession was unconstitutional. Because the legislative and executive officers of the seceding states violated their oath to support the Constitution of the United States.The Senators and Representatives before mentioned, and the members of the several state legislatures, and all executive and judicial officers, both of the United States and of the several states, shall be bound by oath or affirmation, to support this Constitution
Last edited by Mizzou415; 01-14-2012 at 05:20 PM.
Since the Constitution involved a far stronger federal government than the articles of confenderation, if secession was a viable alternative, it would have been covered. It wasn't. End of story.
And treason, for those who haven't taken a look, is MAKING WAR and support enemies against one or more of the several States. Just leaving is not making war or supporting enemies.
So are we locked into the United Nations because I'm sure we've had some treaty or another that says we will support the mission of the U.N. to bring good on earth and joy to all. So if the U.N. changes and we don't like it, are we by "the very nature" of pledging support to the U.N. locked in and deserving if they send troops to bomb us if we choose to leave that union?
Last edited by VAPA; 01-14-2012 at 05:36 PM.
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